For a guy like Sundin I could see a deal in the $7-8-mil range per year, just because he's a pretty dependable player and he's been a leader on the Maple Laughs for quite some time now...but $10-mil/year should be reserved for players that consistently put up 100+ points or are in the top 5-10 of scoring every year. Sundin has cracked the 100-point plateau just once in his career and is more correctly labelled a point-per-game player. I'll give him credit for being a perennial 30-goal scorer, but you can get that cheaper than $10-mil. I hope the reason Markus Naslund left Vancouver is because he saw the desperation of his club and felt insulted by it.
The best thing the Canucks can hope for is Sundin does not take their offer. This is a player who opted NOT to be traded to a Stanley Cup contender at the deadline. This in a year when he becomes a free agent anyways. What does that tell you about him? He is not championship material. It's not like he had 3 more years left with a team and city he likes which would maybe make it a different story. The Canucks are fools if this clown takes up 20% of their payroll for 2 years. He won't help them one bit.
Ladies and gentlemen, the discussion is purely academic: Sundin is not coming here. If it was just about money, he'd have signed - the Canucks offered more money over a shorter span than any other team. At 37 years of age and already quite well off, (thanks, anyway) why would Sundin come to a team in this division, with all the added travel to contend with, only to be on a team that has an excellent goaltender but precious little else. He's at the end of his career; the only achievement left to shoot for is to win a Stanley Cup before he retires. Evaluating the opportunities around the league, would Mats Sundin look at Vancouver and say "that's my best chance"?
Is it just me, or do we shut down reality when we talk about the kind of money these guys make. Don't get me wrong - this is private enterprise, and more power to them, and the fans don't seem to mind the ticket prices thru which much of this largesse is passed along. And, I know it's not just hockey. I dunno... it just seems that our priorities are a little skewed - yeah, it happens when you live in a part of the world where everybody is comfortable by global standards, no-one is starving, children have a fair chance of surviving infancy, and we haven't had a real war/famine/natural mega-catastrophe in a long time. But it occurs to me that an emergency room nurse, or an EMT (f'rinstance) saving lives routinely, daily, dedicatedly, and sometimes at long hours and some sacrifice, would require more than 200 years to accumulate the kind of bread we think might be fairly reasonable compensation for someone to play a game shoving a puck around a sheet of ice. Here's an idea. Maybe if we could completely privatize health care, develop records on which nurses save the most lives (directly, or as an assist), carry out life-saving in large ampitheatres, and provide a Cup for the most lives saved in a season, and really compete with other cities/regions/countries for availabnle "talent" we could finally begin to compensate the really important skills we really need in this world, according to what they are actually worth.
He's at the end of his career; the only achievement left to shoot for is to win a Stanley Cup before he retires. Evaluating the opportunities around the league, would Mats Sundin look at Vancouver and say "that's my best chance"?
It has nothing to do with winning the Cup. If that was true, he'd have accepted a deal at the deadline to make a run this year. You're missing the point. Sundin had interest from Van. Montreal and Detroit among others. Van. offered the most dough, with the Habs and Wings offering a serious shot at making a run at the next Cup plus decent dough. He has not taken any of the opportunities and needs a few more weeks to decide? Come on, this is a guy who has all the heart of Marcus Naslund back-checking in an 8 goal game. What does he need more time for? He knew this day would come for a long, long time already. The dude is not out for on-ice success outside of his own personal stats. My gut feeling is he's looking for a bit of a payday, which he'll get anywhere he goes and to not have too much pressure put him on him. That's what guys with very little heart look for and he fits the bill.
Then .. taking a somewhat more cynical look at this ..... Is it possible that N-H-L head-office types are hoping that Sir Mats will keep the media guessing .. so that each and every day during a hockey-less summer .. television screens, radio talk-shows .. as well as newspaper columns .. will have much to justify spending more than mere minutes and a few lines on this favourite pasttime of ours ??? I love watching hockey .. heck, I have even played it .. but this much banter over the summer when hockey in June is still a fresh memory ??? It seems like a P-R move to keep the game in front of us throughout the year .. instead of giving us a bit of a break.....
But it occurs to me that an emergency room nurse, or an EMT (f'rinstance) saving lives routinely, daily, dedicatedly, and sometimes at long hours and some sacrifice, would require more than 200 years to accumulate the kind of bread we think might be fairly reasonable compensation for someone to play a game shoving a puck around a sheet of ice.
Is it just me, or do we shut down reality when we talk about the kind of money these guys make. Don't get me wrong - this is private enterprise, and more power to them, and the fans don't seem to mind the ticket prices thru which much of this largesse is passed along. And, I know it's not just hockey. I dunno... it just seems that our priorities are a little skewed - yeah, it happens when you live in a part of the world where everybody is comfortable by global standards, no-one is starving, children have a fair chance of surviving infancy, and we haven't had a real war/famine/natural mega-catastrophe in a long time. But it occurs to me that an emergency room nurse, or an EMT (f'rinstance) saving lives routinely, daily, dedicatedly, and sometimes at long hours and some sacrifice, would require more than 200 years to accumulate the kind of bread we think might be fairly reasonable compensation for someone to play a game shoving a puck around a sheet of ice. Here's an idea. Maybe if we could completely privatize health care, develop records on which nurses save the most lives (directly, or as an assist), carry out life-saving in large ampitheatres, and provide a Cup for the most lives saved in a season, and really compete with other cities/regions/countries for availabnle "talent" we could finally begin to compensate the really important skills we really need in this world, according to what they are actually worth.
Naaah!! You're right. It's just me
I'll let you lead the way by starting to pay enough tax dollars to give all nurses, EMT's and school teachers pro athlete salaries. Seriously, a profound thought but it's really hollow at its core. A pro athlete is one in a millionr or less type of person who gets his pay based on his performance in his profession which in turn generates a significant chunk of revenue for his employer. The flipside of that is it doesn't take a one in a million talent to be an EMT, school teacher or nurse. If you want to break it down in a more practical manner, let's take every single pro hockey player in the world. Build a pyramid with the top paid players at the top and the bottom paid players at the bottom. That would include the guys playing pro hockey in the CHL and those other crud leagues for 800 a month plus per diems. Let's then put our teachers in a similar pyramid. The top teachers, based on the performance of their students and other standards that would be acceptable to qualify a teacher as being "good" at what they do and give them a proportionale amount of the pie that ALL teachers are paid. The lousy teachers who fill time, hide behind the union and add nothing to the development of the kids, and yes there are many of them, well they get the CHL player 800 a month. I'd be all for this instead of anyone who teaches getting an automatic wage and instant job security.
Sakic is in the exact same boat as Sundin. Too loyal to his former team, and undecided if he even wants to play.
Here's a question. Surely to goodness...the Canucks could have found out FOR CERTAIN whether Sundin was willing to come to Vancouver BEFORE they made the offer.
Instead, they missed out on plans B, C, D, E, F, and yes...even G!
I'm sorry but Dave Nonis would have made a deal before or during the draft, and he would have landed a better free agent than Ryan Johnson. Nobody wants to deal with Mike Gillis, except for that SLEAZEBALL Francisco Aquillini.
Here's a question. Surely to goodness...the Canucks could have found out FOR CERTAIN whether Sundin was willing to come to Vancouver BEFORE they made the offer.
Instead, they missed out on plans B, C, D, E, F, and yes...even G!
I'm sorry but Dave Nonis would have made a deal before or during the draft, and he would have landed a better free agent than Ryan Johnson.
I tend to agree with Digicart .. it's too bad that some team officers cannot seem to figure that out .. and some of us are not running the team ... ... yet ... given the parameters of where the team is actually located in terms of the N-H-L .. what with its horrendous travel schedule, etc .. how many players actually want to be part of Vancouver's hockey scene ??? Me thinks given the choice between Vancouver and the less rigourous travel, etc. which is part of those teams located elsewhere in the N-H-L .. players choose to go elsewhere .. regardless of the wondrous beauty intinsic in Vancouver's scenery. Even teams located in L-A or San Jose don't have to fly as many miles as do the Canucks .. and why, I do not know.....
Quote from OhYeah: "I'll let you lead the way by starting to pay enough tax dollars to give all nurses, EMT's and school teachers pro athlete salaries. Seriously, a profound thought but it's really hollow at its core."
Not sure what you mean by "hollow." Of COURSE I realize that this is apples and oranges... pro athletes are in the private sector, and nurses and emt's are at the mercy of taxpayers largesse. I have no problem with athletes, singers, actors, CEO's of GM et al, and faith healers making billions... that money is voluntarily offered. And, I didn't mention school teachers, but have a ton of respect for the good, dedicated ones, (and there are more of them than you might allow, even if you never had the good fortune to meet any in your slog thru pub ed.) I was just musing upon the human condition. I am concerned that like ancient Rome, we are exerting our societal energy in the wrong direction - lions, rather than life. I was offering an opinion that socio-anthropologists, in some time far far away, and a long time hence, might question out priorities as a civilized, caring global society. (And yes, this is much more than the Western Worlds love affair with celebs.)
Quote from OhYeah: "I'll let you lead the way by starting to pay enough tax dollars to give all nurses, EMT's and school teachers pro athlete salaries. Seriously, a profound thought but it's really hollow at its core."
Not sure what you mean by "hollow." Of COURSE I realize that this is apples and oranges... pro athletes are in the private sector, and nurses and emt's are at the mercy of taxpayers largesse. I have no problem with athletes, singers, actors, CEO's of GM et al, and faith healers making billions... that money is voluntarily offered. And, I didn't mention school teachers, but have a ton of respect for the good, dedicated ones, (and there are more of them than you might allow, even if you never had the good fortune to meet any in your slog thru pub ed.) I was just musing upon the human condition. I am concerned that like ancient Rome, we are exerting our societal energy in the wrong direction - lions, rather than life. I was offering an opinion that socio-anthropologists, in some time far far away, and a long time hence, might question out priorities as a civilized, caring global society. (And yes, this is much more than the Western Worlds love affair with celebs.)
You're not sure what I mean by hollow and then you go and give the exact reason why your comment was hollow. If it's apples and oranges, then WTF is your point?
Also, I never said I've never met or seen any good school teachers. I've just also seen the ugly side of the union on their last walkout and the lazy work ethic that is becoming very prominent in a lot of teachers (not all, just more than perhaps there used to be).
As for whether or not we're a civilzed and caring global society, there are cases that can be made to suggest we are, but it typically takes a pretty good kick in the nuts before these things get our attention and force a deserving reaction.
Here's a good free agent to dangle 10 million in front of...
Joe Sakic
End of discussion.
I have all the respect in the world for Joe Sakic, but the guy isn't worth $10-million/season either. I think he's worth a fair chunk of coin, but this $10-million for guys at the end of the line garbage is just silly. I mean, at least Sakic has had a 100pt season since 1992-93 (Sundin's last 100+ year)...but I'd rather see that money given to someone that will come in and lead your team in all offensive categories (and even then...$10/yr is crazy)
I think Joe Sakic is worth every penny of $10 Million. The biggest reason? He has Stanley Cup rings. He can score, he can set up, he can win face-offs and he can check. He's perhaps the single most dominant player to play at GM Place outside of current Canucks. PLUS, he's a home-town hero.
Having said all of that, he also has integrity...and will not leave Colorado for ANY price.
The Canucks are going down the drain in the northwest division. That will be evident come October. Sundin is a publicity stunt...if he actually agreed to that deal...I bet the Van City brass would crap ther pants! "Oh man...we signed this old dude for more money than Crosby makes!"
Bottom line...they're leaving Louongo out to dry...it's like he's back in Florida. Maybe his wife will get pregnant again and he'll bail on the season by the all-star break.
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